I agree as well. This isn’t a trial run. It’s the real deal. The thing that’s hard to understand is that even if the rapture happened tomorrow it would mean three and a half years for the mark. Basically, in a few weeks or months we will be there. Not years away. God did give us warning signs. Maybe, at the eleventh hour God will slow things down. I’m not sure. I understand where you are coming from though. It does feel as though the cart is in front of the horse.
I see nothing about a “Secret Rapture” either.
I do see to the church of Philadelphia given a promise to remove them before the Tribulation.
Because you have kept My command to persevere,
I will also keep you from the hour of testing
that is about to come upon the whole world,
to test those who dwell on the earth.
I am coming soon.
Hold fast to what you have,
so that no one will take your crown.
If these are not dispensations of the church age, why would he make this specific promise to this church and not the others?
It’s not a strawman they are real people who have created the Scofield Reference Bible over 200 years ago.
Oh yes it is a straw man argument, since Paul and the other Apostles created the scripture we reference nearly 2000 years ago. 1800 years before Darby and Scofield. I will also stick with scripture.
You present them as authorities and quote them and what you have heard over the word of God sitting right in front of your eyes.
I also thought I saw it in Scripture as in Thessalonians when they thought they missed the rapture, but it doesn’t say rapture, it says JESUS coming.
Actually… It does say rapture, as in Caught Up (Harpazo in the Greek, Rapturo/Raptus in Latin which is transliterated as Rapture in English)
1 Thessalonians 4:17
After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.
I don’t want to argue with you if you want to do the research before you’re so quick to jump to conclusions or don’t .
Actually I think you do want to argue, as you can’t be that naïve to not know this forum and most on it are Pre-Trib rapture believers. And you assume no one else has studied scripture but yourself, when someone disagrees with you.
That you get testy and insult says a lot about your motive here.
Teren are you really going to make me answer this again…??
Oh Ok! Here we go again.
" How is it that you would consider to use 2 different “generations”
I did not say two different generations you did. The only generation started in 1948. Add 40 years (A Jewish Generation), then 1988 ends the generational period.
But that generation is not gone, they need to live out their life spans right?
Add mans’ years of 70 years to the beginning and end.
1948+70= 2018 at one end, and 1988+70=2058 at the other end. 2018 to 2058 . Logic dear Teren says the rapture did not happen in 2018-2019-2020. Do you know how I know how?
Why your are still here to talk to. Now 2021 is still up in the air all the way to 2058. But I suspect it will be sooner than later. Now we must allow for the 7-year tribulation, so we knock off 7 years from 2058 to arrive at 2051 for the rapture of the church at the very latest for pre-trib.
But that is another 30 years away, and I can’t see it taking that long with the current state of the world as we know it.
I would love to be able to tell everyone when the rapture will be but I can not.
I can only say that it should fall within the parameters that I laid out above with one exception that I discount.
That would be Israel being disbanded once again as a nation. That would bring everything to a screeching halt and reset the clock.
So the rapture will take place in this generation anytime from an instant from when one reads this, up until 2051 at the very latest. Unless you are mid-trib, then it could be at a maximum of 2054 years and 6 months.
I have heard many preachers say a generation is 100 years.
But honestly I believe that is because they did not want to teach prophesy to their congregations.
Yes the pretrib will happen. Its in God’s word n He does not lie
A response is testy? Actually I just thought that other Christians could talk about different perspectives but apparently not in this cult.
And there it is…
Your words drip contempt. Because you are mad, and we don’t agree with you for the most part, everyone here is a cult.
You replied to BrianT with:
I don’t want to argue with you if you want to do the research before you’re so quick to jump to conclusions or don’t .
How is that not testy and insulting?
But you are right, no need to argue about it.
Yes, that’s what I’m trying to say!
Hey guys, or mods…if it’s okay, I think maybe we should close up this thread. I don’t want anyone who isn’t convinced of the pre trib view, or just has questions / trying to understand it, getting let go or leaving on their own. It’s not a salvation issue, so I can just study on my own. Thanks everyone for all the links and info though…just want all of us brothers and sisters to stay together in these last days, and certainly want to keep our precious forum open Also, sorry for opening up this can of worms!..maybe someday I will be just as convinced as some of you all… I got a ways to go & i’m behind most of you with studying the scriptures. Be blessed
In 1 Thessalonians 4:17, if you read the verses preceding, HE doesn’t say before or during the tribulation, in fact HE doesn’t say at all. HE does say in verse 5:4 that the day of destruction doesn’t come on us like a thief in the night…(to me, meaning, but to those not in HIM, it will.) I actually didn’t know that there was a rule on this platform that people can’t have different perspectives about the last days and I also don’t see where it says JESUS comes back 3 times.
Don’t worry, I’m a big girl. Ironically, I haven’t gotten any emails from this forum and when I did I saw your post. I was a pretrib believer for years but I’m not now at all and I don’t think it’s a salvation issue either. There isn’t any pastor or person I agree with on everything 100%, not even my husband so I thought we could talk about it and I want people to prepare for the worst and pray for the best because JESUS will keep us and some of us will probably be martyred for HIS Name. Either way, we win. Thanks for sharing.
Wow. You sure lit a fuse 1jewel.
A lot of info to absorb if you have the time and mental endurance.
Only my take on this. Looking at the entirety of Scripture, How does The Father operate with His Creation? I am sure you can find, especially in Proverbs where there is a clear way God deals with two groups. The righteous and the wicked. I personally see three groups in the world. Also reference Malachi 3:18.
The saved. The wicked. The lost. We are one of those three.
There are God’s true worshippers as I prefer to call those truly born again.
There are those who I believe will always be wicked much like most of the Pharisees and Saduccees. Jesus and John the baptist made it clear there is a race of the Devil.
Obviously, the multitude who sought Him with need and repentant hearts looking for the truth. However, in the parable of the seed and soil, not all find their full way to salvation.
As you may have heard Pastor JD mention many examples of types of raptures in the Scripture. Enoch was taken much like Elijah. Sodom and Gomorrah. Noah. The Exodus. Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego. Philip and the Eunuch in Acts 8. (Please no picking these apart they are what they are you dont have to agree)
But the one thing that stands out to me is when Jesus mentioned what it will be like before His return. It would be like the days of Noah and the days of Lot. The synopsis is that everything would be business as usual. Just because we are wearing masks and fighting over vaccines does not mean we have not acclimated to this new world system. We are still buying and selling. Planting and building. Marrying and being given in marriage (LG community).
Then He tells us that we must be ready or else That Day will come on us like a trap. Warned but without warning for those who disbelieve. We who have ears to hear and eyes to see are considered watchmen.
The Tribulation is a seven year period. Probably not exactly seven years as the days will be shortened but it has a clear initiation and conclusion.
So if we know He will return after seven years, how can it be unexpected? There has to be an event that is unexpected first for us to waiting for. Jesus also made it clear that it would be A Day like no other. There will be no mistake that something horrible has changed. Why would He commission the Prophets to warn and the watch\men to warn. It is to protect those who may be in harms way of a catastrophe approaching.
God has always been trying to protect us from harm. We however are constantly ignoring His warnings in this life and we usually suffer for it. I stress this life because Jesus said in this world or this life we will have tribulation, but The Judgment of God is not for those who have been saved by The Blood of Jesus.
When we used the phrase saved, what were we saved from? Hell obviously, but really it was The Father’s Judgment of wickedness. Though we may still sin in our born again state, we were saved from Judgement because we chose The Cross over our own desire to live life apart from Him. We will still suffer in this life because God has not judged the wicked yet.
That is what The Tribulation is for. And even in the midst of His Judgement, He is giving the wicked and the lost one last chance to choose the right and reject the wrong. There is no proof of a watered down first half of His judgement for His sheep. Why would a loving Shepherd save His sheep from the wolf to throw them in the fire?
Thanks Ken. The reason I asked is because I never heard looking at the original generation as a Jewish generation. And as that period came to a close in 1988, to add 70 years as the average length of man’s life (a general life span use of generation) after an original Jewish generation turned out not be to the rapture event timeframe, was an approach i have never heard before. Thanks for explaining that. It makes sense as you have laid it out.
I remember reading John Macarthur’s book: The Second Coming. In that, he mentioned that 1988 really came as a shock…as it came and went. At that point many theologians threw in the towel on thinking about the fig tree as Israel. Many were disillusioned. MacArthur makes the case that it certainly is not wise to date set (not that we are…and i think keeping an open mind is good). And he does not and uses 1988 as a case in point. But when I read that i thought, “How does John know a generation is 40 years in the bible? And does that actually eliminate the fig tree as Israel?” To me, that seemed to quick to cut bait and run. To me, it seemed like what the US might do, like you know: Baby Boomer, Gen X, Gen Y, Gen Z etc. Every 40 years I believe. Like we may have been using marketing years or something. So i tried to find some research on that.
The best thing i came across i’d like to share. It is pretty good i think. It suggested 2018 as a favored rapture date. It gave reasons why. But how it looks at the bible and biblical generation as used in scripture is I think the most thorough account of it i have seen. You may have different ways of looking at this though. Would you say the case this paper makes about biblical generation use is how you would also understand? Or might you see it differently?
One reason I am asking is because it looks like there are a few options as how to view generation. But the timeframes ends close to your tally…but just beyond…2068. Would you ever consider a generation start period from 1967? I’ve seen some do that. Would you ever consider it a proper use of generation to start at that later date? Blessings.
Go read dispensational truths by clarance Larkin -it will enlighten you - blessings
Actually only two types not 3 - saved and unsaved
Hence why I said " I personally see"
One Criminal - Lost
One Criminal - Wicked
Jesus Christ - The Righteous
Ken, I am confused. Bear in mind I hate math/numbers. Wouldn’t that mean folks would have to be living to be 120 years to be the generation alive if it started count at 1948? When I looked it up I found there was only one woman recorded who lived to be that age (she’s gone now).
Dispensations are a lie and I’m wondering why my post was tagged and deleted for responding kindly? No one answered about Isaiah 26:20 either? Thank you for the recommendation but I believe we’ve always been in the age of grace since the fall.
Well actually you had my post deleted my position and the Scripture references. Isaiah 26:20? Are you all like the cancel culture… you delete and cancel logical responses that don’t agree with your perspective?