Local church heartache

Hello brothers and sisters, on my heart today and many days is my church. The lukewarm, dead American church. I have been feeling this way for awhile in my church but especially now. Given it is so evident that these shots are evil and there is no truth to the covid narrative I am struggling to be in our church. There is no mention of what time it is. In fact, everything is as if it were normal except the fear of covid.

There is no talk about mandates, the fear, the lies, what time it is. Nothing. The elephant in the room is not being discussed. The pastor has not mentioned covid except in the very beginning saying not to fear (bravo!). Well that was the last of it. The majority have went and took the jab and been in fear ever since. This past year we went down the street to another church most the time bc they didn’t have masks (and had student programming) , PTL. But, returning to our member church that brought programming back, its hard. With more evidence , ample evidence of where everything is at, I don’t think I can sit in that church and follow along when so much of the Word is ignored and no warning to the flock. The other church down the road was bolder, asking some questions, but again, no mention of what time it is and what is really going on. No dots connecting.

I feel so out of place. Today I went up to greet an old friend at church (older in age too) who I used to meet with regularly in prayer group. I was so happy to see him it was my natural reaction to go to hug him. He backed away from me as though I had the plague and said, oh no, I can’t do that. I said “oh no, but why”? Just came right out of my mouth along with the bewildered look on my face (yep, no poker face here). I couldn’t believe it. We are in a bible believing church and yet here is a godly man, who has followed the Lord longer than I have and I cannot tell any difference from him and the world. My heart is so grievous about this. We have been praying about what to do but I just wanted to lay it out there. To think that I am in a mega church and people in my circle of life there have no question or idea of where we are at prophetically, just living their lives like its all fine. Believing the lies. Nothing coming from the pulpit. No warnings.

I praise God for the discernment He has given me and all of us. But I wonder, what am I supposed to be doing in the church? I am like a square peg trying to fit into a round hole. An alien in a CHURCH pew.

I wonder, what does God think? That here we are in such historic prophetic events, leading up to the most historic events of the world as prophesied, and we are not talking about it in our churches. Its so surreal.

Thank God for Pastor JD and all of you and the small circle of friends I do have that understand.
Please share if you are also having problems at your church and if you have tried to talk to the pastor or staff.:heart:

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Same issues-and I’m glad you mentioned it…because I literally thought it was just me. I figured maybe I had been locked up for too long-or maybe I was having anxiety. But I feel you. I couldn’t shake the creepy feeling, and as I looked around, it was just people, going through the motions. Enjoying the music and the “outing”. I love the online church with JD. Every week, I feel happy because he reads the news and has the SAME creepy feelings and it makes me realize that those who know, know. :yellow_heart:.

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Bless you sister! Yes, its an “outing”.
I can’t wait to hear Pastor JD’s update .

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Hello @Blessed . Have to talked privately with your pastor to see where his heart is on the matter of “what time it is”? It may be that he is fearful of opening that conversation with the congregation. Your encouragement may be all he needs. It couldn’t hurt to ask. I will pray God gives you wisdom and to whether or not you should. I have listened on the radio and on live stream Youtube to Alistair Begg for 6 years and love his teaching. When the big P hit, he closed his church and just taught alone at the podium on YouTube for almost a year. All during that time, I never heard him speak about the current times and was quite let down to put it mildly. I wanted to give him grace, so I continued to listen and tithe to his ministry because I had grown so much all the years of listening to him. I do not have an actual church that I attend, sadly. I have been also watching JD on YouTube for over 2 years and have also tithed to his ministry. This is where I am to be, for now. I know it is what the Lord is leading me to do right now so I continue to hope that I can be in an actual church soon. Waiting and hoping!

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You are not alone. I have a circle of Christian friends who I met more than a decade ago from a life group at church. We have been friends for many years, through many major life events and big changes. Though some of us have moved and life has taken us in different directions and to different churches, we have still been good friends and getting together every now and then, even after all these years.

Anyways, when I started seeing all these prophetic things taking place, I naturally wanted to talk about them. I’ve tried talking to my Christian friends. No one is interested. No one seems excited about Jesus returning. No one seems to understand or recognize or care what time it is on the prophetic clock. Almost all of them ran out and got the jab as soon as humanly possible. One drove across the state to get jabbed immediately when local appointments were not available, and is now having all kinds of bizarre health problems.

If I mention anything about the Book of Revelation, all I hear are crickets. (This feels so strange since we actually STUDIED the Book of Daniel together!) I’ve tried sending e-mails of Pastor J.D. Farag’s videos and other relevant videos. Nobody wants to talk about it. But recently, two “friends” (husband and wife) made clear that they don’t want to hear anything at all about prophecy. They believe that discussing what is going on in the world as it relates to the Bible is “fear mongering” and “living in fear” and “not obeying the command of Jesus.” But I don’t understand what they are so afraid of. We don’t have anything to fear if we are in Christ Jesus. And Revelation 1:3 promises a BLESSING to those who read and hear that book. What Christian doesn’t want to be blessed? And why would God give us the prophetic books unless He wanted us to STUDY them and LEARN from them and APPLY them? And who are we to cherry pick what is and isn’t important about God’s Word?

It makes no sense to me why a bride would not be excited about her upcoming wedding day. So then I am left wondering: Who is really part of the Bride??? I know it is not my place to second guess another person’s salvation. So I just turn them over to the Lord. (Man looks at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart. 1 Samuel 16:7.) God knows who is truly His, even if I don’t. But still, the question bothers me: Why can’t they SEE what I see? And why aren’t the people who have celebrated with me through holidays and wedding celebrations and baby showers and infant dedications willing to celebrate with me now, at this most important time??? Are they too afraid because they don’t understand the prophetic books they’ve been hiding from? I really don’t know.

I am remembering Matthew 10:13-14. Sometimes you just have to let your peace return to you, shake the dust off your feet, and move on. I know that verse isn’t entirely applicable, but it kind of summarizes my feelings at this point. My family has joined a new church that does talk about Bible prophecy, and we are looking forward to getting connected there. And I am incredibly grateful for all the people on this forum who share ideas and lift one another up in prayer. It helps to know that other Christians “see” what is prophetically going on.

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Very powerful words. You pretty much summed up mixed feelings and emotions.

And I’ve been wondering that too…

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Thank you sister!

I was just looking back at my sermon notes from earlier this year when he was talking about the events of the day- in a very mild and summative fashion. The reason he does not address what time it is - he believes the rapture is post-trib (which I just learned this year). So his theology is all wrong and hence the state of the church today there. No mention of Israel and its role. So I give him grace because of this huge mistake. Even so , he should be warning about what time it is and that the Second Coming is in sight.
Thank you so much- I am starting to be in more earnest prayer about what God wants me to do specifically in this situation. I do need His wisdom.

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Yes, we have said that before and isn’t that so very true; not many getting excited. Breaks my heart that when I talk about it in these church circles with a heart of joy people are uncomfortable and don’t want to think about it. I just heard Pastor Jeffress on a recent sermon saying we should all be excited at His Coming.
I think that is a good response to people going forward… “If you are born again you are the bride of Christ and you should be excited for your upcoming wedding to the King of Kings”…something like that.

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Thank you for sharing this. Absolutely heartbreaking and jaw-dropping.

This reminds me of some college friends who I studied with last year. I wanted to see what God would do , be part of it, encouraging and growing with them. The majority of them though don’t want to hear about prophecy/what time it is either. They want to talk about the things of the world. I stopped studying with them because it grieved my heart on many levels.
Now I have learned they are going to study a book about how to live as a Christian as an empty nester. Great confirmation why the Spirit was grieving me in that group.

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Hi Blessed this is from my pastor

As I said, this is an important and complex issue worthy of consideration by the leaders of our Church. I do note that the FDA does not mandate vaccination. However, whether a state, local government or employer, for example, requires or mandates COVID-19 vaccination is a matter of state or other applicable law.

I understand that there is a bill in the Ohio Congress prohibiting mandatory C-19 Vaccine requirements since it hasn’t received full U.S. Food and Drug Administration approval. It has only been approved for emergency use. In addition, I understand that a recent Supreme Court Ruling could make it difficult for the government to overlook religious objectors’ concerns. Granted, The Supreme Court’s decision does not apply to mandates put in place by private companies. It would be hard for the government to definitively prove that religious exemptions are more harmful to public health than existing medical exemptions.

In addition, very few faith groups oppose vaccinations. Generally speaking, the UMC encourages folks to get vaccinated. Moreover, Vaccine mandates are often considered reasonable and necessary in the healthcare industry and sometimes with childcare workers.

I also learned: Employers have an obligation under the Occupational Safety and Health Act (OHSA) to ensure they provide a safe and healthy work environment for their workers. The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) have determined that COVID-19 meets the definition of a “direct threat,” able to trigger heightened safety measures in the workplace. Although the EEOC has not yet released guidance on mandating a COVID-19 vaccine in the workplace, the regulations and guidance from these federal agencies currently provide employers with the flexibility to institute a variety of safety policies. Requiring that employees get a vaccine will likely be considered reasonable.

Once an employer determines that a true religious exemption exists, the employer must make an accommodation for the employee. Such accommodations may include reducing a mask requirement, modifying work duties to comply with social distancing, adjusting an employee’s schedule, or allowing an employee to work from home.

I also learned that for religious accommodations, the employee should be asked to provide an explanation of his or her sincerely held religious beliefs and, if necessary, appropriate documentation from his or her religious leader regarding the religious belief that conflicts with the employer’s vaccination requirement. That brings to question what is the UMC’s position on vaccination.

In my brief review of the UMC social principles, I see no prohibitions on any vaccinations. There is recognition that the C-19 vaccine is approved for emergency purposes and thus experimental. “Physical and mental health has been greatly enhanced through discoveries by medical science. It is imperative, however, that governments and the medical profession carefully enforce the requirements of the prevailing medical research standard, maintaining rigid controls in testing new technologies and drugs utilizing human beings. The standard requires that those engaged in research shall use human beings as research subjects only after obtaining full, rational, and uncoerced consent.” BoD Social Principles Paragraph 162 N)

On the other hand “Corporations are responsible not only to their stockholders, but also to other stakeholders: their workers, suppliers, vendors, customers, the communities in which they do business, and for the earth, which supports them. We support the public’s right to know what impact corporations have in these various areas so that people can make informed choices about which corporations to support.” BoD, Social Principals, Para. 163, I.

Finally, in reviewing the UMC website you will see widescale support for C-19 education, and vaccinations including local churches throughout the world. The West Ohio Annual Conference supports and encourages persons to receive the C-19 vaccine. Thus, a parishioner would have to submit to me, scientific, legal, medical, and Biblical evidence to be exempt from the vaccine for me to consider signing such an exemption.

This may not be what you wanted to read. It is hard and complex with so many factors to consider ranging from the freedom to choose while being conscious of the health and safety of others and the economy.

Nick

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Jaw dropped reading this…literally

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Oh my gosh. That is astounding. Literally no discernment at all. A robot if you will.

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Maybe they don’t want to hear about the rapture because they are too wrapped up in the world and are not ready to serve Christ whole heartedly. I am sure that is why churches today don’t teach about end times. They are fearful and ignorant and are happy staying that way. As you have said, “It grieves the heart”

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Hmmm. . . a pastor who cites legislative bills, OSHA, EEOC, employment laws, corporate stockholders, other faith groups, a denominational website and principles . . . but not one verse of the BIBLE.

Hmmm. . . a pastor who demands parishioners submit evidence from science, law, and medicine, which are NOT the business of the church. When the Bible is mentioned, it is listed DEAD LAST.

Hmmm. . . a pastor who demands that roles be reversed: that parishioners should submit Biblical evidence to teach the pastor what it says in the Bible, rather than the pastor feeding the flock with Biblical evidence.

Interesting . . . .

Um, forgive me for being blunt, but . . . Why are you attending this church???!?

I’m not sure if this person is Biblically qualified to be in a position of spiritual authority over others. (Educationally qualified is NOT the same as spiritually qualified!)

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So this thread has made me remember a sad experience from college, which I think I should share to shed some light on what might be happening:

My college roommate did not believe in God, despite the fact that her dad was a pastor of a Presbyterian Church in California. Her parents divorced while she was young, and she was raised by her mom, who was an unbeliever. I was very concerned about my roommate not going to heaven when she died. I told her I was very worried about her not being saved. I told her I was worried about her eternal soul. I encouraged her to talk to her dad to learn about Jesus and being saved. I thought I was doing her dad a favor – what pastor wouldn’t want to know that his own daughter wasn’t saved?

Well, a few months later, my roommate came back to me angrily. Her father had told her she was fine, that God would never send her to hell, even though she didn’t believe in Him, because she was a “good person.” She was mad at me for making her question herself, in the off-chance that God ended up existing. Yes, she was mad at me! I was floored! It never occurred to me that a PASTOR of a mainline Protestant denomination would lead his own daughter off a cliff like that. But there was no chance she would listen to me after her own father had told her those lies. After all, I was just a 20-something year old. Her dad was a pastor of a large church and had graduated from seminary. Why would she listen to me?

I can’t explain the whiplash / shock / disillusionment that I felt at that point. I grew up un-churched, having to read the Bible for myself and learning about God mostly on my own. I envied people who grew up in church. It was disillusioning to see that I loved the word of God more than someone who was supposed to be an “expert.”

So it is my opinion that there are probably many, MANY churches in America - and throughout the world - being pastored by unbelievers. I suspect some of them desire to be social workers, but find the prestige of being in control of a church more socially acceptable to their male gender. I suspect that others run into church leadership as an attempt to suppress and/or cover up deep-rooted sin. (A different friend’s grandfather was very high up in the Episcopal Church, and then one night police showed up at the door handing him over to his wife after they had arrested him for public indecency with dozens of other men at an outdoor rest stop. Before he died a few years ago, he admitted that he had no faith in God at all.) So if churches are being pastored by unbelievers, that might explain why they are not warning the flock or excited about the return of Jesus. They view church as a do-gooder social club or as a cover to hide behind. (I’m not saying that this is always the case, but it might account for some of the problem.)


Just in case any baby Christians or non-Christian inquirers/seekers are reading, here are some verses to prove why my college roommate’s father was Biblically wrong:

Ephesians 2:8-9:
“For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.”

Isaiah 64:6:
“all our righteous acts are like filthy rags”

Romans 3:23:
“for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God”

Romans 3:10:
“As it is written: “None is righteous, no, not one”

Luke 16:15:
" ‘You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is exalted among men is an abomination in the sight of God.’ "

Romans 5:12:
“Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned”

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Thats why we have to stay awake and not follow blind Pastors and Bible Teachers just because they are well known. We are brothers and sisters in Christ and everyone is on the same level. And sadly, many are attending churches because they are there for many years and even they recognize that the Pastors arent teaching about the endtimes, they stay instead leaving. Not teaching about the endtimes is censoring the Bible. Billy Crone talked about this and I agree with him on that topic. How could you go into a church that doesnt talk about the actual times? Or more sadly, think that the jab is a Gift from God?

I had to leave my church last year before the plandemic started and after what I saw I know that this decision came from God, because my church is now a laodizea church and dying because the endtimes are not preached and they bow down to the satanic restrictions.

The church of God are the believers. So if you dont have a church, make contact to other believers who are awake, so you can encourage one another. And try to spread the Gospel as much as you can and pray that God sends you people that you can give testimony how Jesus saved you.

I encourage everyone to leave a church that censors the bible and turned a blind eye at the endtimes because you wont grow in your faith in such an environment, because they wont listen to your warnings and I know believers who were told to shut the mouth by trying to talk about the danger of the jab and the endtimes. Pray to God, that you find other believers who are awake and worship God together if you can meet them in person. Time is short for us now. We have to make the best of it.

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Good morning

Oh I was the committee chair for SPRC at this church and attend regularly pre Covid!

I wanted to share with Blessed that we left this church and have been part of this online church with Pastor JD and have started a small Bible study.
So as encouragement to our Brothers and Sisters around the world God is Great and will provide for use in many ways

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Thank you for sharing that. That is extremely troubling. I believe every word of it as I see the majority of people we talk to on the streets about the Gospel have no idea. This must have been so difficult- and with a pastor! That is such a sad story and makes me sick. Yes, I believe many churches are led by wolves in sheep’s clothing. And then it makes you feel like a bad person to the world when you share truth. You pleased the Lord when you shared truth. Perhaps this will come back to her someday.

I have been there. But God- when we know the Word we can stand on it and the Holy Spirit convicts us and blesses us for being obedient.
I tried to share with my husband’s family who follows Catholocism. I did not know their specific beliefs at that time and wanted to talk about it out of love. They were deeply offended by the truth and believe if we are good we go to heaven. His Dad kicked me out with my husband and daughter. They didn’t want to hear about the Bible at all- it was an offense to them. Husband and daughter were also rude to me for telling truth. I was in such despair that day but I knew the Word. I was especially sad for my husband who knew the Word, but was more concerned of pleasing man than God.
My husband later that day admitted he was wrong (he just didn’t want controversy) and he ended up sending an email (not as good as directly discussing but better than nothing) sharing that he was wrong about his reaction to me and he shared the Gospel with them. I felt a great peace from the Lord after that. That I did what I was supposed to do. I knew from that point forward to expect warfare when sharing truth.
It is very costly with others when we speak truth. Any time it happens I have to remind myself of Jesus’ own words to us , not to be surprised and to remain in Him.

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Kris I feel in my soul that your words are probably right- to leave my church and be with those who are awake. Perhaps first meet with the pastor. My other variable is my husband who serves there.
I feel that as things are going God will show us pretty quickly what to do.

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Thank you for sharing that Nick. That is an encouragement to me!